Registering will remove ads
KnitePrince

The POINT of control points?

Recommended Posts

    I went in alone today, and went off to clear the map.. I figured I could clear all the areas out... control points, hostages, broadcasts.. etc, etc...   Cleared the closest control points, propaganda broadcasts, etc, etc, and started working my way out....   Except, as I went to do the third or forth control point... I see the one I took first is red again?  wth is that? I cant even keep it for half an hour?  I went and took it back, did a hostage situation, and the second control point I cleared is now red again...  So.. i am completely confused.. all the resources i gave the control point officer are gone, and the control point is under hostile control again...  WHAT IS the point?  WHY would I even do this? KNOWING the enemy is going to own it ten to fifteen mins later?  I understand that were at war of a sort... but.. why cant we keep these places for a few days, or at least HOURS... and THEN the real struggle to HOLD them happens?  Instead... I see no point in RE taking them?  What am I missing?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites


Registering will remove ads

It's too hard to maintain them all. I felt I'd have to spend all my game time running around gathering resources to keep them all going. I had just maintained one in the main areas, since they are handy for fast travel.

Some of them go ages before they need more supplies and others, as soon as you turn your back, they've run out! Not sure if it is random or goes by the number of reds about.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, KnitePrince said:

    I went in alone today, and went off to clear the map.. I figured I could clear all the areas out... control points, hostages, broadcasts.. etc, etc...   Cleared the closest control points, propaganda broadcasts, etc, etc, and started working my way out....   Except, as I went to do the third or forth control point... I see the one I took first is red again?  wth is that? I cant even keep it for half an hour?  I went and took it back, did a hostage situation, and the second control point I cleared is now red again...  So.. i am completely confused.. all the resources i gave the control point officer are gone, and the control point is under hostile control again...  WHAT IS the point?  WHY would I even do this? KNOWING the enemy is going to own it ten to fifteen mins later?  I understand that were at war of a sort... but.. why cant we keep these places for a few days, or at least HOURS... and THEN the real struggle to HOLD them happens?  Instead... I see no point in RE taking them?  What am I missing?

I don't think the point is to ever control them all. They are probably poorly named and the info about supplies does give the impression that by keeping them supplied they should stay under friendly control.

Relating them to other open world RPG's out there, I just think of them as randomly resetting world events. That's really all they are.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah I think you are right.. I was quite disappointed that I couldn't keep the ones I had taken, so I basically quit trying to take them, and just do the struggle to keep a few where I like to travel to... kind of ruins the fun, but okay.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

But I disagree....😝

I do think the point, or one point of the end game is to control the board.  This is not doable solo - at least not yet.

What I am driving at is the strategic aspect of the game.  Now, this is probably just BS on my part but...

If I take out a control points 'minions' raising the threat level, but don't act on it.  When that threat level is back to 1 and you take the control point, for me at least, I keep it for a long period - days or longer.  But if I raise the threat level to 3 or 4 and take the control point (yeah I get good loot) it seems that control point gets overrun sooner, sometimes in hours.   And if you rescue a control point under attack, again I seem to keep it far longer.

Just a thought.  More data required.  I starting thinking about this when my control points started getting overrun.

Note that the map seems to have perfect intel showing you  where attacks are headed.  Why do that if there was not a bigger purpose?

You mileage may vary.

...gene

 

Edited by genedjr

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, genedjr said:

But I disagree....😝

I do think the point, or one point of the end game is to control the board.  This is not doable solo - at least not yet.

What I am driving at is the strategic aspect of the game.  Now, this is probably just BS on my part but...

If I take out a control points 'minions' raising the threat level, but don't act on it.  When that threat level is back to 1 and you take the control point, for me at least, I keep it for a long period - days or longer.  But if I raise the threat level to 3 or 4 and take the control point (yeah I get good loot) it seems that control point gets overrun sooner, sometimes in hours.   And if you rescue a control point under attack, again I seem to keep it far longer.

Just a thought.  More data required.  I starting thinking about this when my control points started getting overrun.

Note that the map seems to have perfect intel showing you  where attacks are headed.  Why do that if there was not a bigger purpose?

You mileage may vary.

...gene

 

I think like a lot of things in The Division's life cycle they started with grand ideas and then ditched or dumbed them down.

If you remember back in the development of the first game, there was a video released which made it seem like we would have multiple bases or settlements. That never happened. 

Of course we were also supposed to have drones that a player could log in on their tablet and control to help us. Lol!

I think the control points and overall territory control were something they had bigger plans for and either couldn't get it to work the way they wanted or didn't have time to finish. So we got what we got.

 

 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

/sigh - update.

I cleared 10 control points yesterday, NONE of them are in control now.
I am OOO until the patch - there is simply no point to play, even fun play.

For me, even though I really want this game to succeed - this is a low point.  I will post another thought on the wildly drastic changes.

...gene

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

CP's flip far too rapidly. I've secured CP's, opened the map to see an enemy attack coming, I've fully resupplied the CP, travelled to the WH, opened the map again and .. the CP is taken by the enemy. 

Do they even fight when you're not there to see it?? The impression I got (1-30) was if I kept the CP's stocked they could defend themselves...expending the supply points with each attack and once the supplies got low it would be over run.

Get to tier level and this seems to go out the window for CP's changing hands based on some random BS RNG. I've seen CP's change hands when enemy attacks weren't even attacking them on the map! 

It is ... for a PvE Roleplayer style player like me...very demoralising. 


In 2010, a crack commando unit still evading prison for a crime they didn't commit promptly escaped from another maximum security stockade near the Manhattan underground to the Washingon D.C. swamp land. Today, still wanted by the government they survive as soldiers of fortune. If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them....maybe you can hire The Division 2 Team.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To be clear, I have no idea what the trigger is once you get to Tier 1-5 on how CP's change hands. There seems to be no basis on the supplies they hold or if there's an actual enemy attack. 

I have tweeted asking, have to see if it garners any response. 

I think once we know the mechanisms we'll feel better/work to combat it. However, I suspect its purely RNG and aimed at keeping "idle Agents busy so they don't complain about lack of content"...which is NOT they way it should be. 


In 2010, a crack commando unit still evading prison for a crime they didn't commit promptly escaped from another maximum security stockade near the Manhattan underground to the Washingon D.C. swamp land. Today, still wanted by the government they survive as soldiers of fortune. If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them....maybe you can hire The Division 2 Team.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 4/27/2019 at 8:31 PM, Oh. daesu said:

It's too hard to maintain them all. I felt I'd have to spend all my game time running around gathering resources to keep them all going. I had just maintained one in the main areas, since they are handy for fast travel.

Some of them go ages before they need more supplies and others, as soon as you turn your back, they've run out! Not sure if it is random or goes by the number of reds about.

Yeah they seem to run out a lot quicker than gathering said resources. It's also true & it is hard to find & gathering resources for all the Control Points. I know because I went out looking resources in enemy controlled areas. A lot times I get shot at by said enemies & even killed trying to collect a lot food,water,& other resources for the Control Points. I only collect it if I come across any food,water,& other resources. Then I give all my resources to any Control Point officer if I have any on hand in my backpack. Because not worth dying for just to get a few points. You would be better off taking enemy Control Points,doing main missions,& going after bounties to get better & higher points.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

From my own experience, the factional  activity in their area affects their consumption / supply of the resources. Not just whether they are being attacked, but their own capacity to resupply themselves. Not sure how well their algorithm works. Just feel it might factor in not just access to supplies but availability of personnel to go for resources. So, between casualties and patrols, their pool of personnel might not be sufficient to resupply over a period of time.

Not sure whether consumption is a constant, or consumption varies based on attacks. But guessing capacity to resupply varies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Oh. daesu said:

From my own experience, the factional  activity in their area affects their consumption / supply of the resources. Not just whether they are being attacked, but their own capacity to resupply themselves. Not sure how well their algorithm works. Just feel it might factor in not just access to supplies but availability of personnel to go for resources. So, between casualties and patrols, their pool of personnel might not be sufficient to resupply over a period of time.

Not sure whether consumption is a constant, or consumption varies based on attacks. But guessing capacity to resupply varies.

I think Ubisoft should fix this problem with the rate of consumption of resources  & supplies fictional or not. If  this was real life we can or could make resources like food,water,& other supplies last for weeks even for months. If we really had too during a time of war civil or not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Malcolm Kocinski said:

I think Ubisoft should fix this problem with the rate of consumption of resources  & supplies fictional or not. If  this was real life we can or could make resources like food,water,& other supplies last for weeks even for months. If we really had too during a time of war civil or not.

There is no scale to compare it too though. How much food is 1 point of food? Is that one can? Is it a pack of gum? Are 4 points equal to 1 can of food? We don't have any basis for how much food and water we really are giving to the supply points, so the rate of consumption is something we can't really measure and say it is too fast, too slow, or just right.

 

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Prvt3Jok3r said:

There is no scale to compare it too though. How much food is 1 point of food? Is that one can? Is it a pack of gum? Are 4 points equal to 1 can of food? We don't have any basis for how much food and water we really are giving to the supply points, so the rate of consumption is something we can't really measure and say it is too fast, too slow, or just right.

 

Yes you might be right about that. It's really hard to tell on how much these Control Points might have or get on resources & supplies and how much is used or not at these Control  Points or how much measure is too fast,slow,or just right.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

  Taking the control points and making sure they are fully stocked on resources and supplies should at the least last for the play session.  Taking the strategic control points you want/need to travel becomes pointless, and a huge waste if they are taken over while you are off taking another control point... and I don't even want to talk about that blockade.. THAT is annoying having to go take it back about once an hour.. I have killed enough of them that they should be nearing extinction.   Having people killed should make them THINK twice about immediately trying to take it back. Repeatedly losing people over and over should make taking and holding it exceed the balance.. meaning it isnt worth the cost in lives to try to hold.  But, as we all know computers don't have that limitation..   I fully understand that when you join a game that you are likely logging into a different instance than the one you OWNED the night before, so you cant still have control...  However, WHILE logged into an instance you SHOULD be able to maintain...

   I have basically just started running with the patrols..  look for the green gun on the map heading somewhere, and I go join them and help them create havoc wherever they are headed..  If I see a red gun headed to a control point I own I usually go wipe them out before they get there... actually have been having fun doing that, but occasionally when I check the control points.. I see that one I have been defending isnt MINE anymore??  there was no attack on it, ownership just swapped...  apparently they ran out of resources and died of starvation...

 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/11/2019 at 3:42 AM, KnitePrince said:

  Taking the control points and making sure they are fully stocked on resources and supplies should at the least last for the play session.  Taking the strategic control points you want/need to travel becomes pointless, and a huge waste if they are taken over while you are off taking another control point..

THIS! 

However, I don't think players can use too much real world logic such as "how many tins of beans do people eat in a day" or "how many enemies by number is there in DC". It is, after all, a game...think of it as a D&D game perhaps. Exactly how many Goblins ARE there in this world? The adventure party seem to have killed 1,000's yet more seem to appear in the dungeons they go into? Why? 

Because the GM keeps populating them! There's no point to a finite number of enemies or enemies who act naturally and in seeing a dungeon cleared by an adventuring party don't go back there "because its dangerous".

However, there's no logic to the rotation that I can see. Some people have actively cleared the maps in one game session...but before they finish CP's are retaken as fast as they're liberated. 

We really need to know the mechanisms at work, I think we'd feel better about this if we did. 


In 2010, a crack commando unit still evading prison for a crime they didn't commit promptly escaped from another maximum security stockade near the Manhattan underground to the Washingon D.C. swamp land. Today, still wanted by the government they survive as soldiers of fortune. If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them....maybe you can hire The Division 2 Team.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, quinch1199 said:

THIS! 

However, I don't think players can use too much real world logic such as "how many tins of beans do people eat in a day" or "how many enemies by number is there in DC". It is, after all, a game...think of it as a D&D game perhaps. Exactly how many Goblins ARE there in this world? The adventure party seem to have killed 1,000's yet more seem to appear in the dungeons they go into? Why? 

Because the GM keeps populating them! There's no point to a finite number of enemies or enemies who act naturally and in seeing a dungeon cleared by an adventuring party don't go back there "because its dangerous".

However, there's no logic to the rotation that I can see. Some people have actively cleared the maps in one game session...but before they finish CP's are retaken as fast as they're liberated. 

We really need to know the mechanisms at work, I think we'd feel better about this if we did. 

Huh? I never really thought of it that I was using real world logic in video games that I play. I always thought when they like Ubisoft made & released  their video games. I thought they made them to be like a real world and didn't think they weren't really made that way logically.

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As you move up tiers, you should be able to upgrade control point defenses (like you do the crafting bench) so the 'Resistance" can better fight against the attacks rather than fold like a house of soggy cards..

  • Like 2
  • Upvote 1

You want some, come get some.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On ‎5‎/‎9‎/‎2019 at 6:51 AM, quinch1199 said:

CP's flip far too rapidly. I've secured CP's, opened the map to see an enemy attack coming, I've fully resupplied the CP, travelled to the WH, opened the map again and .. the CP is taken by the enemy. 

Do they even fight when you're not there to see it?? The impression I got (1-30) was if I kept the CP's stocked they could defend themselves...expending the supply points with each attack and once the supplies got low it would be over run.

Get to tier level and this seems to go out the window for CP's changing hands based on some random BS RNG. I've seen CP's change hands when enemy attacks weren't even attacking them on the map! 

It is ... for a PvE Roleplayer style player like me...very demoralising. 

The purpose to control points is to open up loot. 

 

If you give the control officer 50 of each supply you will find much more loot in the surrounding area and it will also be highlighted brighter making it easier to find. 

 

That is the point of them. It means you essentially control that area. There are a couple of CP's with very good loot runs and you can test this by doing the run without having the control point and then after having it and you will notice a big difference. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So, the point is to GIVE them loot, so we can find loot easier.. self defeating..  Why not NOT give them anything and then you won't care about finding more?  In doing all the control points to open the storage rooms, I usually find quite a lot of loot along the way.   Also.... In the last couple games I have played, the control points seem to be "staying" longer than before? Is that a thing now or is it just my wishful thinking?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, KnitePrince said:

So, the point is to GIVE them loot, so we can find loot easier.. self defeating..  Why not NOT give them anything and then you won't care about finding more?  In doing all the control points to open the storage rooms, I usually find quite a lot of loot along the way.   Also.... In the last couple games I have played, the control points seem to be "staying" longer than before? Is that a thing now or is it just my wishful thinking?

 

It's mainly to help you farm supplies. For instance, if you need electronics for recalibration you will want to take CP's in the Hyena territory and you will find much more if you have their CP's.  When you open your resources tab it tells you where to find each resource in greater supplies and taking the CP's in that area increases that chance. 

Edited by Disneyadventure
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, basically what we give CP is not a consumable resource for us. What we get ir confind is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, KnitePrince said:

So, the point is to GIVE them loot, so we can find loot easier.. self defeating..  Why not NOT give them anything and then you won't care about finding more?  In doing all the control points to open the storage rooms, I usually find quite a lot of loot along the way.   Also.... In the last couple games I have played, the control points seem to be "staying" longer than before? Is that a thing now or is it just my wishful thinking?

 

All I know that Control Points or Point Control were used in the Military as Outposts to keep on eye on enemies movements & to restock on fuel,ammo,food, & a place to rest for awhile. Here's one definition of a Control Point or Point Control:

FM 19-25 Chptr 4 Point Control - GlobalSecurity.org

Point Control or Control Point :

A. Traffic control point (TCP) is a designated spot on the ground or road network--in a static garrison type environment--where Military Police control the traffic flow.

The three goals in point control of traffic are orderly movement of traffic in accordance with traffic control plans, no unnecessary traffic delays and minimum essential control methods. These goals should be accomplished with maximum use of traffic control devices, relieving MPs of this duty when possible.

When

Traffic control points should be used in the following situations:

Road network is inadequate to accommodate traffic.

Serious delays or congestion occur or are anticipated.

Traffic studies indicate a particular need for control.

Security of designated persons requires special control.

Interruptions of traffic flow are reported to Military Police.

A location becomes unsafe.

https://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/19-25/CH4.htm

List of military strategies and concepts - Wikipedia

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The point of control points is to open up the loot. 

 

Each control point has an area of effect, once you take it and donate 50 of each resource, you don't need to give 100, more world loot becomes available and easier to find in that area. Including more resources, outfits, weapons....all of that. 

 

So if you are farming titanium you will want to take a control point, donate the 50 resources, and you will find a lot more, go to the next one and do the same and hopefully after you are done the first one is taken back over and resets so you can do it again. 

 

If you are doing a lot of recalibration you will need lots of supplies and this is how you get them easier. So no, you don't want the CP to stay green, you want them to flip back as quickly as possible so you can farm materials. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I use CPs to fast-travel around the map. It's very irritating if I have to retake them in order to make my travelling more efficient.


The ocean is on fire...........The sky turned dark again as the boats came in........And the beaches, stretched out with soldiers, with their guns and arms..........It has just begun

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.